Ludivine Sagnier: France’s Best-Kept Secret

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Interview by Nicole Holland

Since age 23, Cannes Film Festival veteran, Ludivine Sagnier, has starred in a steady stream of premieres in Cannes that includes: Swimming Pool (2003), La petite Lili (2003), Paris je t’aime (2006), La Californie (2006) and Les chansons d’amour (2007).  Also in 2003, she was introduced to America with the psychological thriller and mystery film Swimming Pool, which was one of the largest grossing foreign movies in the United States in 2003. In 2002, Sagnier won the Chopard Trophy award for Female Revelation at the Cannes Film Festival. During that same year, she won and shared the Best Actress Award at the European Film Awards with the ensemble cast of 8 Women: Catherine Deneuve, Emmanuelle Béart, Fanny Ardant, Isabelle Huppert, Virginie Ledoyen, Danielle Darrieux, and Firmine Richard. In addition, Sagnier was nominated for three Césars: Best Supporting Actress (Un secret, 2008), Best Supporting Actress (Swimming Pool, 2003) and Most Promising Actor (8 Women, 2002).

Throughout Sagnier’s career, she has worked alongside French icons such as Charlotte Rampling, Vincent Cassel, Benoît Magimel, Deneuve, Béart, Ardant and Huppert and under the direction of auteurs Claude Miller, François Ozon, Claude Chabrol, Jacques Fieschi and Christophe Honoré, to name a few. Recently, she just completed filming Lee Tamahori’s new film The Devil’s Double, which is featured in Corsan World Sales 2010 Marché du Film line-up. Ludivine plays, Sarrab, Uday Hussein’s mistress, and Latif Yahia’s secret lover. This year, Sagnier has two films premiering in the Marché du Film: Alan Corneau’s Crime d’amour (Love Crime), a thriller with Kristin Scott Thomas (TF1 International) and the independent film Pieds nus sur les limaces (Lily Sometimes) with Diane Kruger (SND Groupe M6).

In this exclusive interview, Independent Film Quarterly’s Nicole Holland spoke with Ludivine Sagnier as she discussed her Cannes experiences, her latest lead role in The Devil’s Double, biographical roles and her breakthrough role.

IFQ: In 2003, you made your Cannes debut with Swimming Pool and La petite Lili. Can you tell me about your very first experience at the Cannes Film Festival?

Ludivine Sagnier: Cannes is a special adventure, not only for French people, but I think for every actor that I’ve met. It’s a special thing. It’s actually like a good wine; every year has its own taste. My first time, of course, was very spectacular. I remember I didn’t really expect much.  I just expected a moment, like walking up the red carpet. That’s all I knew then. As I did it, I found out there’s something magical about it. Actually, it was like time stopping. It was a surreal moment.

IFQ: Then, you returned to Cannes in 2006 with Paris, je t’aime and La Californie and then again, in 2007, with Les chansons d’amour, which was nominated for a Golden Palm. Which year was most memorable for you and why?

LS: Well, the thing is every year is a different perspective of how to see the festival. I’ve shared this festival with many different people and different projects, so it’s really difficult for me to say which moments were the most important. The most striking was, obviously, the first time. Now I know how lucky I am to be a part of all this. I got somehow use to all this success throughout the years.  It is still a lot of pressure no matter how huge you are. It’s getting more and more comfortable and familiar because I’m meeting more and more people. It’s a very small world with movie-making people.

IFQ: Your latest film, The Devil’s Double, an Iraqi tale, is based on the life story of Latif Yahia who was forced to become the double of Saddam Hussein’s son, Uday Hussein. This film is quite a departure from the films we are used to seeing you in. What attracted you to the script?

LS: Well, I wouldn’t say it’s a real departure. You know what I like about cinema? To always be where people don’t expect me to be! I’m always departing from somewhere to somewhere else because I like to surprise myself, and others. But, actually, in that particular film, it was Lee (Tamahori) who attracted me to the film. Of course, I was a big fan of his and especially his Once Were Warriors. I didn’t understand why he wanted me to play this part. I was not necessarily the obvious cast to play this prostitute in Iraq in the 90s. It wasn’t obvious to me at all. Lee was completely convinced that we could make it happen. I just followed him.

IFQ:  How was your experience working with Tamahori in terms of his direction and approach to other directors you have worked with in the past, such François Ozon and Claude Chabrol?

LS: First of all, he speaks English like in Lord of the Rings! [Laughs.] I’m just joking. He’s a New Zealander, so he has a very strong accent, but I do too. At first, I got to know Lee as the director of Once Were Warriors, which is a very independent spirited movie. Sometimes people tell me: You are working with Lee Tamahori; he’s a blockbuster director. The thing is, I didn’t find out at first that he had directed several studio movies and that he was very good at it. To me, he wasn’t a blockbuster director at all, and that’s what I liked about him. I don’t think it’s very common for a director to be experienced in doing art-house movies, and on the other side, to have this skill to direct any blockbusters and any size of budget. And Lee, he is just in between. He’s a free spirit with a very unusual technical base. He’s at ease with all the technical issues. He can burst a car and he can have 1,000 extras in a shot. At the same time, he’s very comfortable and intimate in directing actors in a very precise and realistic way. So, I think he’s got it all.

IFQ: Could you briefly discuss your role as Sarrab in The Devil’s Double?

LS: Sarrab is Uday Hussein’s girl. And to me, she is more than that. She’s an extremely romantic character because she actually didn’t choose him; he chose her. She’s said to be the ‘Best Fuck in Baghdad,’ which is kind of a label. [Laughs.] She’s trapped in a very complex and dangerous system because she’s a prisoner of a very dangerous man. There’s everything to her:  there’s beauty; there’s danger; there’s love. There are secretive issues. There’s an escape and dramatic ending.

IFQ: How did you go about preparing for the role?

LS: It was an enormous challenge because, as I said, I was really far from being Sarrab at the beginning. I had to get rid of my Northern European roots, as much as possible. I had to embody the Middle Eastern attitude. The dancing classes, the talent of the costume designer Anna Sheppard, who’s a very, many-times rewarded, costume designer, and the make-up artist all helped.  We had fun together and were completely supported by the absolute determination of Lee, so we made it possible. It was kind of a challenge, really.

IFQ: Prior to filming, did you read Latif Yahia’s books The Devil’s Double, I was Saddam’s Son, and Black Hole?

LS: Yes. I read many of them. I wasn’t really told to make it too personal, but it gave some keys to my imagination. The movie we’re doing was not a biopic, really. It’s a real fiction that lies on true facts.

IFQ: I was reading Latif’s blog and saw that you met him. What are your personal thoughts on him?

LS: I remember meeting him for the first time in London. It was very impressive. I didn’t know I was going to meet him. I just ran into him.

IFQ: Did he know that you were playing Sarrab in the movie?

LS:  Yes. We were having a meeting with Dominic (Cooper) and Lee, and we were in the hotel, and he knew he was going to meet me. He had done some research and all that. He had done kind of an un-said approval. He was not really asked about these kinds of artistic issues. It was really frightening in a way because suddenly he was a witness, in flesh, of a part of a worldwide story that we don’t really know much about. We know about war. We know about how many people got wounded, and how many people got killed, but we don’t know the background of it. Suddenly, every day, day-after-day in the news, you hear many things about Iraq. It ends up not being that concrete, especially for French people who do not have any soldiers involved in this war. Sometimes, it seems so far away. Suddenly, having this guy in front of me made me understand how brutal reality was. Suddenly, I felt more and more conscience of the story of Iraq. I felt much more closer to that part of the world.

IFQ: What did you take away or learn about yourself by playing Sarrab?

LS: I learned from the story, as I said, that I was much more conscience. Also, I learned that in the Middle East, the most honorable and unrewarded soldiers are willing and we don’t talk about them at all. The only things we hear about are politics and soldiers dying. There are so many people fighting in their daily lives in order to get a normal life. And Sarrab, with all the glitter around her, she’s still a survivor.

IFQ: You play opposite Dominic Cooper, who plays both Uday and Latif, in the film. While filming, how did you separate your scenes as Uday’s concubine and Latif’s secret lover when, in fact, Dominic was playing dual roles?

LS: It was a pretty awkward situation, actually. Dominic was doing some motion capture on the green screen and, in his mind, he was two totally different spirits. I had to follow him. He had a stand-in through the whole movie, so I had to play with that. For me, it was okay. For him, it must have been spiritually draining. The thing is, he had really distinct looks and behaviors. It wasn’t difficult for me to follow him because I really had the impression of having two characters in front of me.

IFQ: Latif’s story is difficult to digest due to the Husseins’ inner circle of graphic torture, murder, and rape. He has said in interviews that he was psychologically damaged. While you were on set, how did you distance yourself from the film at the end of the day?

LS: What I’ve learned from doing cinema over the years is that it’s sometimes easier to distance yourself from the most cruel and tragic story. It’s so outrageously painful that it’s a natural reflex to take a step away from it. Actually, I also think that, throughout the years, that it is the privilege of experience. I somehow learned to switch on and switch off when it’s required. I don’t get confused too much with the emotion that I’m playing with.

IFQ: You also tackled the biographical role of Sylvia Jeanjacquot, Jacques Mesrine’s girlfriend in Public Enemy No. 1. Which role (Sylvia or Sarrab) was more challenging? Why?

LS: The thing is, they might be similar because they are both gangster girls. They are very different because the first one, Sylvia, fell in love with a man without knowing anything about gangsters and their rules. She has to deal with a world that she doesn’t know well. She doesn’t have everything in her hands. At the end of the movie, she gets shot in the car. The action for me was very spectacular and physical—all the bullets, the noise and the blood were all very impressive. Regarding Sarrab, I think she’s a woman who knows the game she plays. Her evolution is much more psychological than physical. My acting was the same because she escapes; she doesn’t have to face Uday and his violence.

IFQ: Which do you find harder to play: biographical or fictional characters?

LS: It’s very inspiring to play biographical characters because there are so many details at your disposal to feed your imagination. However, this is also very challenging because you have a certain duty to be faithful to the truth. When you are playing a fictional character, you have no boundaries; you can go wherever you like. It’s really two different things.

IFQ: Continuing on the thread of roles, have you ever identified with any of the characters you portrayed at any point in your career?

LS: [Laughs.] I actually always find that in the characters I portray. I think its part of the job, actually. They always have something that I wish I had and that is why I go for them. Luckily, I know how to put enough distance between me, and them, which is what I wasn’t able to do at the beginning, when I started being an actress. But now, I have the skill so I don’t let any character mess up my own life. But still, I embody them completely, heart and soul, until the wrap day. And then, I just go back to my life.

IFQ: Over the course of your career, you have been known to take risks with your roles. Ozon’s films often have an underlying theme of human sexuality, in particular Lesbian/Gay/Bisexual/Transgender (LGBT). For instance, there was an underlying sexual tension between Sarah (Charlotte Rampling) and your character Julie in Swimming Pool.  In 8 Women, you play the youngest tomboy daughter Catherine and there are lesbian themes between Gaby (Catherine Deneuve), Pierette (Fanny Ardant), Madame Chanel (Firmine Richard) and Louise (Emmanuelle Beart). In Water Drops on Burning Rocks, you are part of a bisexual love quadrangle where your fiancé leaves you for another man.

LS: [Laughs.] This one is amazing. I love it!

IFQ: [Laughs.] And switching over to Christophe Honore’s Les chanson’s d’amour (Love Songs), you play Julie, one of the three lovers living in Paris.  All four films were highly successful in France. So given the risqué subject matter, were you ever hesitant to accept the roles?  Furthermore, what attracted you to these roles?

LS: Well…[Laughs.]

IFQ: I’ve followed your career and I kind of started noticing this theme, especially in Ozon’s films.

LS: Yes, but of course, if you saw all these movies together, it’s true. They are a bit sexual. I think it is a very subjective point-of-view because love stories, sexuality, and romance are all a part of daily life. It’s pretty much what life is all about. I think it’s very natural to be attracted by that kind of topic: Who we are, who we love, and why we love them. I think this question is sentimental. I think movie-making has the duty to ask them. I don’t think there’s much of a difference in America, but maybe there’s more objectivity to it.

IFQ: Why do you think the French are more open to these types of films than Americans?

LS: I thought it over. I’ve been asked this question quite a few times. Sometimes when I come to America and I do an interview, the German says, so how is it to be an actress who plays naked in films? [Laughs.]

IFQ: So blunt. [Laughs.]

LS: I’m like, oh, okay…I was really shocked by this kind of attitude, but then I had to really think it over. I think America is a huge country that has been built up by dreamers. Throughout the generations, they have been used to an ideal life and its issues. That may be the reason why America is at ease with prudeness. There’s always something like another point-of-view of life. Suddenly, looking at something simply as they are can be shocking.

IFQ: In 2003, you were introduced to America with the psychological thriller and mystery film Swimming Pool, which was one of the largest grossing foreign movies in the United States in 2003. Why do you think the film did so well in America? Also, what are your feelings or thoughts on how this film stands in your overall body of work and the international exposure it helped provide for you?

LS: This is a very tough question. I think it did well because it was a good film, first of all. Yes, it was a worldwide exposure for me. I think it’s a privilege for an actor to be known for at least one famous movie. Whenever I meet American directors or actors, they are like, “Oh my God, you are the girl from Swimming Pool.” Even many years afterwards, they still remember me. I think that’s a big luxury to be famous for at least one part. I also have the feeling that this movie is a part of worldwide history now, history of cinema, and I’m very proud of it.

IFQ: I’ve read that you are currently working alongside another Cannes Film Festival veteran, Kristin Scott Thomas, in Crime d’amour.

LS: Yes. I finished the movie last week.

IFQ: Can you share anything about the project?

LS: It’s a great movie. It’s a psychological thriller. It’s the story of antagonism in the business environment. We work in a tower in a very huge enterprise. It’s a question of humiliation and revenge. It’s a very accurate story with the perfect details and the perfect recipe for having an enjoyable moment in the movie chair, just like reading a novel by Agatha Christie. It was really enjoyable working with Kristin Scott Thomas, who is a brilliant actress. We got along so well. We had a lot of fun playing antagonists. It’s going to be called Love Crime. It’s directed by Alan Corneau, who’s very famous in France for doing very good thrillers.

IFQ: Finally, can you comment on the film Pieds nus sur les limaces that you are working on with another Cannes Film Festival alumnus, Diane Kruger?

LS: That’s amazing. That’s one of the most exciting experiences of my life, actually. Of course, working with Diane, but the whole package of the movie was great. We get to play two sisters in the countryside and we are mourning our mother who died prematurely in a car accident. Things are getting a bit difficult because my character is sort of a misfit and fighting for her independence. It’s a movie about sisters, relationships, freedom, love and independence, and it’s absolutely overwhelming.  I’m such a big fan of this movie. It’s going to be called in English, Lily Sometimes. Lily is my character. Diane Kruger is the sweetest person on Earth, and we had the loveliest time. I’ve worked with the biggest actresses in France, and I have to say that Diane Kruger is one of the most generous people I’ve ever met. We had the most intimate experience together. But you know, it was possible, because it was a very low-budget movie, very independently produced. We were very close with the team, doing improvisation and all that. It was a very special moment and it’s going to be a very special film, I’m sure.